haikujaguar: Meanwhile... Worth of a Shell

M. C. A. Hogarth (

haikujaguar) wrote,
@ 2008-04-16 16:38:00

Current mood:	very tired
Entry tags:	books, jokka, marketing, the worth of a shell, writing

Meanwhile... Worth of a Shell

Dlane at Dusk

Today I printed out the manuscript for Shell to edit, something I'm hoping won't take very long (how many times have I edited this book by now?). While I'm not planning on releasing this one until autumn, at the rate I'm working I realize I have to start on it now. Some thoughts, then:

• I worked out the price; looks like I can do a color cover, B&W interior on cream paper for about $7-8, the same you'd pay for a normal paperback. I am pleased!

• The cover is going to have to be "Dlane at Dusk" (above)... that's the iconic picture of Dlane, whether or not the book is told by someone else. I think, to make it work, I might do an Art Nouveau style frame for the title/author/back cover blurb.

• I'm not sure whether to use some of the old B&W imagery I've already done as interior illustrations or do new pencil pieces... I know I want to add some calligraphy and maps and other inserts, I'm just not sure about the drawings. If I do new ones, I have to start now, given how slow I'm working.

• I'm not sure yet whether I want to serialize this online or just have the first three chapters or so available. If I serialize every novel I've written (even discounting the ones I think are no longer viable), we'll be here years before we get to anything new.

• I do, however, want to drum up donations for this one so I have an "advance" to cover the time I'm going to spend working on putting together the interior. Not sure how I'm going to do that if I don't serialize it.

Anyway, just the things I'm mulling over now while I still have plenty of time to decide. But I keep realizing that the trade-off for giving away all the control for these things to other people is... that I'm giving it away. Being able to choose whether to include illustrations and which, whether I want alien calligraphy in the book or not, whether to include maps, glossaries... to be able to give you the whole story, not just the writing part... really, I'm happier doing it this way and I think the product is better for it too. Hopefully those of you who bought the hard copy of The Aphorisms agree. :)

Stardancer Home.

(Post a new comment)

arielstarshadow
2008-04-16 08:44 pm UTC (link)

Two other possible ways of generating donations:

1. Those who donate get their names on an Acknowledgments page (just like the Aphorisms).

2. Jokka print sales! Or really, print sales of any kind.

Yes, I do agree with you that the more control you retain, the better - and I suspect what you're doing will become more popular as authors become more tech-savvy. Of course, most of them aren't as multi-talented as you, so they don't have the option of doing their own covers (but if they're smart, they'll work out barters or trades with artists) and illustrations; nevertheless, I think that "self-publishing" or print on demand is only going to grow in popularity. There's still a bit of stigma attached to it now, but with pioneers such as yourself, that won't last forever.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

haikujaguar
2008-04-16 08:46 pm UTC (link)

Ah, the acknowledgments idea is a good one! Thank you!

I am lucky to have some very talented people willing to barter their services (or give me outright as their version of a patron gift)... I am not a layout person by any stretch of the imagination, and having a copy-editor has been very very handy. So I don't think people will need more than a writing talent to get by. I just think I'm lucky, in that this mode suits me better than usual because the stories I tell are in multiple media. :)

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Thoughts ysabetwordsmith 2008-04-16 09:38 pm UTC (link)
	I consider the time I spent critiquing an early draft of this novel to be time well spent. g Even the brief span in which I wanted to throw it against a wall. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts arielstarshadow 2008-04-16 09:53 pm UTC (link)
	Throw it against a wall? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts haikujaguar 2008-04-16 10:13 pm UTC (link)
	Let's just say I wasn't very good at plotting when I wrote the original draft. -_- (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts arielstarshadow 2008-04-16 10:37 pm UTC (link)
	This makes me feel a LOT better about the THING that is supposed to be a book growing on my computer. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts haikujaguar 2008-04-16 11:15 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, I have written a lot of drek, believe you me! :) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	Re: Thoughts archangelbeth 2008-04-16 11:00 pm UTC (link)
	I can't decide if I'm reassured that you didn't walk out of the sea of papers like Venus, or boggled. O:> (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts haikujaguar 2008-04-16 11:15 pm UTC (link)
	Oh no. My first three books were very bad. Four, if you count the one I wrote in grade school. -_- And the first of those three was 256,000 words, so you see I got a lot of bad writing out in one big push. And that's not even counting the short fiction and false starts! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Thoughts archangelbeth 2008-04-17 06:27 pm UTC (link)
	I'm boggled. O:> (Reply to this)(Parent)

archangelbeth
2008-04-16 08:50 pm UTC (link)

Hmmm. I set my mind in motion!

What about donations for the first 3-6 chapters (depending on word-count), setting the donation "caps" for what would satisfy you as an advance, and then putting those serialized ones online with a pointer to the Amazon (or whatever) site to buy the physcopy?

Alternative: get your advance, and put the whole thing up, along with a physcopy version.

Alternative 2: Serialize in an abridged form! Use selected bits of the chapters, or flash-fiction "snapshots" of the plot, and get your advance from donations that "unlock" that, in fewer chapters than the Whole Thing. For the Whole Thing... buy the book.

Alternative 3: Serialize more than one thing at a time. You have this mostly finished, yes? So you could presumably set each chapter up to unlock as it reaches the Magic Number, while doing other projects at the same time. This does risk exhausting your patrons' fund-pool, though, and slowing down all the projects as your patrons have to pick and choose which one they want to fund most.

BTW, on the cover image there? If you're not putting a "frame" around it, I'd suggest superimposing the words at the bottom, and not the top. (In case you hadn't already thought of that. Heh.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-16 08:52 pm UTC (link)
	muses on ideas I do think to support #3 I need a lot more readers, so I'm going to wait on that one. The other two ideas are interesting. As for the cover image, I'm going to frame it in Art Nouveau style arabesques, so there will be room for the title block on top. :) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	archangelbeth 2008-04-16 08:54 pm UTC (link)
	Yay, framing! O:D I note that for Alternative 1, that should probably have added: "Retain a Donate button, of course!" Not everyone might want the physcopy version, but they might want to have an easy way to throw money atcha. Yay, ideas to muse upon! O:D (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-16 10:23 pm UTC (link)
	Hmm. It occurs to me that I don't have the original for this piece, so the scan I have is the only scan I'll ever have. I should experiment with printing out since fidelity to the original isn't an issue. Maybe I will have proof copies for sale next week. Posters of fwooshy anadi! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	archangelbeth 2008-04-16 11:01 pm UTC (link)
	Ooo, fwooshproofs! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	ysabetwordsmith 2008-04-17 03:40 pm UTC (link)
	Yeah, now imagine the soaring market value of the now-cover-art original. Wasn't that one a commission to a collector? I'll bet he's thrilled. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-17 05:11 pm UTC (link)
	I bet! :) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	artfulruin 2008-04-16 09:03 pm UTC (link)
	I definitely agree. Not all authors are multi-media artists, but you are. Your work is better with you writing, illustrating and designing it than it would be if you just provided the text, and a publisher had all the illo/design authority. (Reply to this)

	siadea 2008-04-16 09:16 pm UTC (link)
	I'll note the fact that the Lost Fleet first chapter being online for free just about made me flail with the desire to read the rest. (Though to be fair, just hearing you talk about this story is sufficient for that.) (Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-16 09:26 pm UTC (link)
	I can't wait for the next one. The ending of the third book about killed me. -_- (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	tuftears 2008-04-16 10:33 pm UTC (link)
	You've been reading Lost Fleet too? }:D Anyway, I'll look forward to Shell being an actual buyable book! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-17 12:28 pm UTC (link)
	Oh yes, it's splendid. I met the author eight years ago or so in the SFWA suite and he was such a well-spoken gentleman... I never forgot that, and have been reading his books purposely ever since. :) It's wonderful when you can give money to people you actually like! (Reply to this)(Parent)

Feedback

ysabetwordsmith
2008-04-16 09:46 pm UTC (link)

>>I worked out the price; looks like I can do a color cover, B&W interior on cream paper for about $7-8, the same you'd pay for a normal paperback. I am pleased!<<

I'm thrilled. At that price, in non-broke times, I'll be able to afford giving copies as gifts. *ponder* Have you considered selling bundles at a slight discount or with perks like bookmarks? Two or three books together, for people who want to keep one and give one away or "release it into the wild" via BookCrossing?

>>The cover is going to have to be "Dlane at Dusk" (above)... that's the iconic picture of Dlane, whether or not the book is told by someone else. I think, to make it work, I might do an Art Nouveau style frame for the title/author/back cover blurb.<<

As much as I love certain pictures of Thenet ("Sensing You" and the recent one with all the cross angles) I have to say this is my favorite picture associated with the book. Definitely do the elaborate frame!

>>I'm not sure whether to use some of the old B&W imagery I've already done as interior illustrations or do new pencil pieces... I know I want to add some calligraphy and maps and other inserts, I'm just not sure about the drawings. If I do new ones, I have to start now, given how slow I'm working.<<

My preference would be some of each. I'm especially fond of "Thenet in the Temple" (oh, that stippling!) but would love to see new work too. Howbout you collect the old stuff for us to vote on, and then do a few new pieces to round out the scope of illustration? Less work for you, more input for us.

>>I'm not sure yet whether I want to serialize this online or just have the first three chapters or so available. If I serialize every novel I've written (even discounting the ones I think are no longer viable), we'll be here years before we get to anything new.<<

I'd be happy with either, but then, I've read it already. *ponder* If I'm going to bail out of a book, it usually doesn't take me three chapters.

>>I do, however, want to drum up donations for this one so I have an "advance" to cover the time I'm going to spend working on putting together the interior. Not sure how I'm going to do that if I don't serialize it.<<

Invite us to sponsor the new illustrations? Invite us to sponsor the sample chapters? Put our names in the book as sponsors?

I'm sure there must be coins under the couch cushions ...

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	Re: Feedback haikujaguar 2008-04-17 12:27 pm UTC (link)
	I too am excited about the price... and the bundling is an interesting idea! Hmm. My concern about mixing the artwork is that it might lack unity. You know, B&W line work one drawing, pencil shaded the next, very modern, very old... :/ (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Feedback ysabetwordsmith 2008-04-17 03:00 pm UTC (link)
	You don't have to offer all the possible examples of old "Shell" art. You could start with a larger-than-needed set of pictures that reasonably went together; if I remember right, you had a substantial collection of pen-and-ink work from that timespan. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	n_decisive 2008-04-16 11:06 pm UTC (link)
	She's beautiful, and the style you've used is one that never fails to delight me. Out of curiosity, what kind of calligraphy were you looking for? If it isn't cursive you need, I'd be happy to send you a sample of what I do using calligraphy pens. My writing without one looks very much like calligraphy. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-16 11:07 pm UTC (link)
	I'm looking for everything from quotes to poems! I would love to see samples... even if just for the delight. I love beautiful penmanship. :) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	arielstarshadow 2008-04-17 01:34 am UTC (link)
	Have you gone wandering through her website yet? 2,452 art images to gape at (and sometimes swoon over) Ahem. 2,453. She added one. I've been working my way forward. Edited at 2008-04-17 02:14 am UTC (Reply to this)(Parent)

razzek
2008-04-17 12:31 am UTC (link)

Squee! I...was going to say more, but it totally slipped my mind. Gnar. D: I love the idea of using using both old and new illustrations in the book.

Re: editing the manuscript - I don't know if you want any more reader feedback or even if this scene is still in the book now, but I had only one complaint about the entire book the last time I read it if you do want any feedback. It might have been just a "me" thing, though, and it didn't help that I was reading it in braille. :D

Also: I still need to purchase the Aphorisms! Thank you for the reminder. :)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-17 12:25 pm UTC (link)
	Sure, send me email. :) (Reply to this)(Parent)

eseme
2008-04-17 03:11 am UTC (link)

I would love illustrations that work with the story. Whether that is old or now... either works for me.

Possibly you could touch-up old illustrations, and have patrons sponros that?

Definitely put up part of the book, but serializing it would take way too long. We can sponsor chapters, and get names in the book.

We can also sponsor maps and poems, caligraphy- anything that counts as new.

Sponsoring the cover is a good idea, for one.

And I love the idea of a Jokka print sale. Sell prints/posters of the cover. Sell prints of old images, or re-scan some of them (I know that one watercolor, of a Jokka sort of leaning up against the world, was wrinkled a bit when it was scanned) and then sell them (maybe take sponsors on re-scanning, say $5-14 for the time it takes you to rescan old art).

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-17 12:26 pm UTC (link)
	muse These are all good ideas... thank you! (Reply to this)(Parent)

lunarennui
2008-04-17 07:49 am UTC (link)

um um um. i believe you know that i am utterly entranced by the jokka, and even though money is REALLY tight lately, i will make whatever sacrifices are necessary to donate and purchase this as a book, entire. which i would prefer over serialized chapters by far.

i know my dime and opinion only go so far, but i personally would prefer that you do as much with this as you feel that you should. i'll be there...i'm a slow runner sometimes, but i'll catch up!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-17 12:27 pm UTC (link)
	Well, at very least there are going to be two electronic versions (PDF and Mobipocket, which will work, among other things, on the Kindle), so if you prefer reading on a computer or device you can still get your wish! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	lunarennui 2008-04-17 10:56 pm UTC (link)
	what i actually meant was that i want it as a book in hand, like the aphorisms. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	haikujaguar 2008-04-19 03:38 am UTC (link)
	Ah, yes, that will be the definitive version. The hard copy should be between $7 and $8. :) (Reply to this)(Parent)

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